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	<title>Comments on: Catch-Up Catechesis &#8211; Kids Out of Sequence</title>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-888</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:04:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-888</guid>
		<description>During the changeover of my blog, one comment got lost in space. I was able to retrieve it and print it here: 

Joni says:
I am a 7/8 grade teacher in a Catholic school setting. I too have students each year that have not received sacraments. I often find that parents send their children to Catholic school for the very purpose of “catching up” with their faith. I empathize with your struggles and yet I try to remember that God has given me the unique privilege of bringing the sacraments to this child. My students are further given the ability to “relive” their own sacraments through the new eyes of their classmate.

Thanks, Joni!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>During the changeover of my blog, one comment got lost in space. I was able to retrieve it and print it here: </p>
<p>Joni says:<br />
I am a 7/8 grade teacher in a Catholic school setting. I too have students each year that have not received sacraments. I often find that parents send their children to Catholic school for the very purpose of “catching up” with their faith. I empathize with your struggles and yet I try to remember that God has given me the unique privilege of bringing the sacraments to this child. My students are further given the ability to “relive” their own sacraments through the new eyes of their classmate.</p>
<p>Thanks, Joni!</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-873</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:38:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-873</guid>
		<description>Roberta, you share great wisdom here. Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roberta, you share great wisdom here. Thanks!</p>
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		<title>By: Roberta</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-874</link>
		<dc:creator>Roberta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:57:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-874</guid>
		<description>It is important that we keep the best interests of the children as a top priority when deciding how to help them &quot;catch-up.&quot;

I have learned to listen to these families closely as most times there are underlying causes, hurts, family messes that have gotten them to this point.  When they choose to come back, that is the time to be the most understanding.  I am learning to leave my emotions behind me and explain to parents that what needs to happen now is to prepare the family as well as the children for the reception of sacraments.
I explain that the process is not about punishment but about preparation.  I explain that sessions, retreats, service, Mass, etc.  are all part of the process to be prepared.  If your child misses math class because they are sick, they are expected to learn the material that was covered.  That is not a punishment but a necessity for your child to be able to continue advancing their math skills.  It is the same in learning about our faith.  I know this is expressed simplisticly but usually parents seem to have an aha moment.

The disrespectful talk and behavior often is a mirror of what the teens have heard or seen at home or think they have regarding church, CCD, and themselves.  Sometimes teens get a sense of no one at the parish being commited to them and they act out.
If parents and church are simply tolerating them, they will respond likewise.  Teens also are well aware of a family&#039;s commitment to attending Mass.  If the family doesn&#039;t come to the church for Mass, the building is foreign to the kids and they literally feel out of place.

How do we change all of that?  Let me know!  Just keep trying and know that change takes time.

When groups have issues of disrespectful students wasting everyone&#039;s time, I would suggest that they be sent to the DRE.  That is the time that I have a talk with a student about everyone&#039;s commitment, have them write a note of apology to the catechist.  If this doesn&#039;t work, I send the apology note home to be signed by the parents.  I explain that if the behavior continues, the pastor and myself (DRE) will have a meeting with the student and parent(s).
Though these measures are last resorts!

I as DRE try to call kids by name as they enter and leave the building.  I try to make conversation about topics that I know are of interest to them.  If you know them, they will feel more in relationship with you and less likely to be disrespectful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is important that we keep the best interests of the children as a top priority when deciding how to help them &#8220;catch-up.&#8221;</p>
<p>I have learned to listen to these families closely as most times there are underlying causes, hurts, family messes that have gotten them to this point.  When they choose to come back, that is the time to be the most understanding.  I am learning to leave my emotions behind me and explain to parents that what needs to happen now is to prepare the family as well as the children for the reception of sacraments.<br />
I explain that the process is not about punishment but about preparation.  I explain that sessions, retreats, service, Mass, etc.  are all part of the process to be prepared.  If your child misses math class because they are sick, they are expected to learn the material that was covered.  That is not a punishment but a necessity for your child to be able to continue advancing their math skills.  It is the same in learning about our faith.  I know this is expressed simplisticly but usually parents seem to have an aha moment.</p>
<p>The disrespectful talk and behavior often is a mirror of what the teens have heard or seen at home or think they have regarding church, CCD, and themselves.  Sometimes teens get a sense of no one at the parish being commited to them and they act out.<br />
If parents and church are simply tolerating them, they will respond likewise.  Teens also are well aware of a family&#8217;s commitment to attending Mass.  If the family doesn&#8217;t come to the church for Mass, the building is foreign to the kids and they literally feel out of place.</p>
<p>How do we change all of that?  Let me know!  Just keep trying and know that change takes time.</p>
<p>When groups have issues of disrespectful students wasting everyone&#8217;s time, I would suggest that they be sent to the DRE.  That is the time that I have a talk with a student about everyone&#8217;s commitment, have them write a note of apology to the catechist.  If this doesn&#8217;t work, I send the apology note home to be signed by the parents.  I explain that if the behavior continues, the pastor and myself (DRE) will have a meeting with the student and parent(s).<br />
Though these measures are last resorts!</p>
<p>I as DRE try to call kids by name as they enter and leave the building.  I try to make conversation about topics that I know are of interest to them.  If you know them, they will feel more in relationship with you and less likely to be disrespectful.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-881</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 21:51:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-881</guid>
		<description>Kathleen, thanks for sharing. It&#039;s clear that you are dealing with a lot of frustration concerning this issue. It is very challenging, isn&#039;t it?

Sounds like the parish as a whole needs to address the issue of the role of parents...that responsibility cannot fall on the catechist or even the DRE alone. Many parishes are succeeding in expecting more and getting more from their parents. When some parents are confronted with the notion of taking on more responsibiity for involvement in their children&#039;s faith formation, they respond, especially when what&#039;s being offered to them is substantive formation for their own spiritual growth, not just information meetings.

As for the kids thinking you&#039;re not their &quot;real&quot; teacher, just remember that the Church has called you to this ministry and stands behind you. God has all authority and has given all authority to Jesus who in turn has entrusted that authority to the Apostles. You are teaching with that authority behind you and don&#039;t ever forget it!

Also sounds like the parish needs to keep up efforts at recruiting catechists. It&#039;s not acceptable to simply toss up our hands and say that we don&#039;t have anyone to teach the high school kids! The parish needs to emphasize the call to serve as catechists and the crucial priority of catechesis.

You no doubt are doing your best and working very hard and for that, I affirm you. Your frustrations are real but not insurmountable. I pray that your parish as a whole will aggressively address these challenges, recognizing that it is our job to invite and challenge people to embrace their baptismal commitment!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kathleen, thanks for sharing. It&#8217;s clear that you are dealing with a lot of frustration concerning this issue. It is very challenging, isn&#8217;t it?</p>
<p>Sounds like the parish as a whole needs to address the issue of the role of parents&#8230;that responsibility cannot fall on the catechist or even the DRE alone. Many parishes are succeeding in expecting more and getting more from their parents. When some parents are confronted with the notion of taking on more responsibiity for involvement in their children&#8217;s faith formation, they respond, especially when what&#8217;s being offered to them is substantive formation for their own spiritual growth, not just information meetings.</p>
<p>As for the kids thinking you&#8217;re not their &#8220;real&#8221; teacher, just remember that the Church has called you to this ministry and stands behind you. God has all authority and has given all authority to Jesus who in turn has entrusted that authority to the Apostles. You are teaching with that authority behind you and don&#8217;t ever forget it!</p>
<p>Also sounds like the parish needs to keep up efforts at recruiting catechists. It&#8217;s not acceptable to simply toss up our hands and say that we don&#8217;t have anyone to teach the high school kids! The parish needs to emphasize the call to serve as catechists and the crucial priority of catechesis.</p>
<p>You no doubt are doing your best and working very hard and for that, I affirm you. Your frustrations are real but not insurmountable. I pray that your parish as a whole will aggressively address these challenges, recognizing that it is our job to invite and challenge people to embrace their baptismal commitment!</p>
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		<title>By: Kathleen Penfold</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-877</link>
		<dc:creator>Kathleen Penfold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 21:08:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-877</guid>
		<description>In our parish, it has become more frustrating each year to have older kids show up knowing nothing. I&#039;m talking about kids from 11-16 who haven&#039;t seen church since baptism, don&#039;t know how to bless themselves, have no clue about prayers, and whose families do not attend Mass regularly. When you ask some of these kids who God is or why He is important in their lives, they don&#039;t know.  When we take them to church, they just stand (or sit, or kneel) and do nothing. No singing, no praying, no nothing.  Just clock-watching.  I&#039;m not saying they&#039;re all like that - this year&#039;s class, for the most part, is wonderful and very receptive - but there&#039;s always a couple of kids in my class I feel I&#039;m working double with just to help them catch up.

An increasing percentage of parents in our parish do not participate in any way, shape or form when it comes to CCD - including coming for informational meetings at sacrament time - so, while it sounds lovely, any attempts at a more inclusive, family-based catechesis would likely fall flat. Additionally, once these kids receive confirmation, they disappear, never to be seen again until it&#039;s time for Quinceanera, Sweet 16, or the wedding.

Recently, some kids have told us flat out that CCD isn&#039;t &quot;real&quot; school, or (as happened this past Sunday) they don&#039;t need to pay attention when we go to correct them because we&#039;re not their parents or their &quot;real&quot; teachers. Don&#039;t get me started on their views on doing homework. And, if we or the DRE complain to the parents, it goes nowhere.

Another problem in our parish is that we no longer have any catechists to teach high school kids who are catching up. They&#039;re stuck in my class with 6th graders for Confirmation I and, if they&#039;re still under 16 after that, get stuck with 7th graders to make the sacrament in Confirmation II. If they&#039;re 16 or over they get put in with the RCIA adults. It is challenging to say the least to try and be inclusive in my teaching. I do my best, but it&#039;s a little tricky to balance being able to talk somewhere in the middle so the 11 year olds can understand but the 15 year olds don&#039;t think you&#039;re talking down to them.

We&#039;re doing the best that we can, but we&#039;ve also lost a few good catechists because their best efforts have been met with disdain by the kids and deafening silence by the parents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In our parish, it has become more frustrating each year to have older kids show up knowing nothing. I&#8217;m talking about kids from 11-16 who haven&#8217;t seen church since baptism, don&#8217;t know how to bless themselves, have no clue about prayers, and whose families do not attend Mass regularly. When you ask some of these kids who God is or why He is important in their lives, they don&#8217;t know.  When we take them to church, they just stand (or sit, or kneel) and do nothing. No singing, no praying, no nothing.  Just clock-watching.  I&#8217;m not saying they&#8217;re all like that &#8211; this year&#8217;s class, for the most part, is wonderful and very receptive &#8211; but there&#8217;s always a couple of kids in my class I feel I&#8217;m working double with just to help them catch up.</p>
<p>An increasing percentage of parents in our parish do not participate in any way, shape or form when it comes to CCD &#8211; including coming for informational meetings at sacrament time &#8211; so, while it sounds lovely, any attempts at a more inclusive, family-based catechesis would likely fall flat. Additionally, once these kids receive confirmation, they disappear, never to be seen again until it&#8217;s time for Quinceanera, Sweet 16, or the wedding.</p>
<p>Recently, some kids have told us flat out that CCD isn&#8217;t &#8220;real&#8221; school, or (as happened this past Sunday) they don&#8217;t need to pay attention when we go to correct them because we&#8217;re not their parents or their &#8220;real&#8221; teachers. Don&#8217;t get me started on their views on doing homework. And, if we or the DRE complain to the parents, it goes nowhere.</p>
<p>Another problem in our parish is that we no longer have any catechists to teach high school kids who are catching up. They&#8217;re stuck in my class with 6th graders for Confirmation I and, if they&#8217;re still under 16 after that, get stuck with 7th graders to make the sacrament in Confirmation II. If they&#8217;re 16 or over they get put in with the RCIA adults. It is challenging to say the least to try and be inclusive in my teaching. I do my best, but it&#8217;s a little tricky to balance being able to talk somewhere in the middle so the 11 year olds can understand but the 15 year olds don&#8217;t think you&#8217;re talking down to them.</p>
<p>We&#8217;re doing the best that we can, but we&#8217;ve also lost a few good catechists because their best efforts have been met with disdain by the kids and deafening silence by the parents.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-878</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 03:25:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-878</guid>
		<description>William, thanks for the clarification about this not being solely a Latino issue. Your experience is sounding more and more typical for so many DREs.

One clarification, there is no such thing as an RCIC. There is only the RCIA adapted for children. You are correct in recognizing that there are not many materials available for children&#039;s catechumenate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>William, thanks for the clarification about this not being solely a Latino issue. Your experience is sounding more and more typical for so many DREs.</p>
<p>One clarification, there is no such thing as an RCIC. There is only the RCIA adapted for children. You are correct in recognizing that there are not many materials available for children&#8217;s catechumenate.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-879</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 03:20:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-879</guid>
		<description>Elaine, hang in there! There are lots of us facing this issue and strategizing ways to deal with it. Take a look at what Roberta offers above.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Elaine, hang in there! There are lots of us facing this issue and strategizing ways to deal with it. Take a look at what Roberta offers above.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-880</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 03:16:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-880</guid>
		<description>Roberta, this is outstanding! Thanks for sharing in such great detail. I&#039;m sure this will help many people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roberta, this is outstanding! Thanks for sharing in such great detail. I&#8217;m sure this will help many people.</p>
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		<title>By: Roberta</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-884</link>
		<dc:creator>Roberta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 19:42:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-884</guid>
		<description>Parishes as well as the families struggle with the variety of issues of why these situations happen.

Initially, I have families come in to talk about where they are in life and hear their stories.  The entire family then signs a family commitment form - 1 for the parish and 1 to take home.  The commitment asks the entire family to commit to:
1) Learning prayers as a family
2) Reading Bible stories as a family
3) Building prayer into family life
4) Attending Sunday Mass
5) Attending Religious Formation sessions faithfully
6) Continuing formation as a life-long process
7) Pledge to become a domestic church of the home, so that the family will be well preprared to receive sacraments and become a part of the larger church community.

Sometimes, people respond with a yeah right attitude. Sometimes, people are thrilled that I have given them the excuse to expect faith to be a priority in the family.
Sometimes, they express, wow, this is a lot but I talk through that we are always striving to be our best and we need to aim high.

I give them the Commitment Forms to take with them.  I ask them to think about it and pray about it and
bring it back when they are ready.

Usually families sign it and begin.  Most often we retain them as active parishioners but there are those that just go through the motions.  Yet continual invitation is part of the process.

I have had a family hold onto it for a whole year before they were ready.  They have been back to church for a couple of years now and they are engaged in parish life.

It seems as though when a life defining moment (along with God!) has sent a family into &quot;seekers&quot; mode, that they are usually open to building relationships within the community and with their faith. Yet families that have the usual societal pressures which begin with time, grandparents, etc. attempt the catch-up; they often don&#039;t end up &quot;seeking.&quot;  They are just coming for &quot;drive-thru&quot; sacraments.

Over the last couple of years, I have tried a couple of different strategies.  What it seems to come down to though is that we need to spend time with these families.  It is a huge commitment on the part of a parish staff but well worth the efforts.

I have had parents do some additional home schooling to help bring children up-to-speed -- this works sometimes and sometimes parents stop because of other life pressures.

I have added an assesment component. (each month, every 2 months) Done very conversationally, non-threatening, yet really dealing with content and after 1 meeting parents usually understand that there is some accountability.

I have had sessions devoted to older children focused on the sacraments which they attend in addition to their regular sessions.  Some years, they don&#039;t attend their regular sessions for that time period.

This year, I have implemented a family RCIA.  Parents along with their children come on Sunday mornings and are learning together.  The parents were not thrilled to start but after a couple of months the parents are really grateful for their formation alongside their children.  I have 3 families.

There are some bumps and I realize that this won&#039;t work for everyone because all of a sudden people will want a 1 year commitment......but if they are truly formed and become a part of parish community,would they seek more for their families??  Could/would the RCIA process be an answer for families?  The parish would then have to have other offerings that would continue to draw them back.  The faith cannot be covered off in a year!  A relationship doesn&#039;t have the definite ending.

Individual situations call for individual attention!  Wouldn&#039;t it be great if we could do this for all the families in our midst?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Parishes as well as the families struggle with the variety of issues of why these situations happen.</p>
<p>Initially, I have families come in to talk about where they are in life and hear their stories.  The entire family then signs a family commitment form &#8211; 1 for the parish and 1 to take home.  The commitment asks the entire family to commit to:<br />
1) Learning prayers as a family<br />
2) Reading Bible stories as a family<br />
3) Building prayer into family life<br />
4) Attending Sunday Mass<br />
5) Attending Religious Formation sessions faithfully<br />
6) Continuing formation as a life-long process<br />
7) Pledge to become a domestic church of the home, so that the family will be well preprared to receive sacraments and become a part of the larger church community.</p>
<p>Sometimes, people respond with a yeah right attitude. Sometimes, people are thrilled that I have given them the excuse to expect faith to be a priority in the family.<br />
Sometimes, they express, wow, this is a lot but I talk through that we are always striving to be our best and we need to aim high.</p>
<p>I give them the Commitment Forms to take with them.  I ask them to think about it and pray about it and<br />
bring it back when they are ready.</p>
<p>Usually families sign it and begin.  Most often we retain them as active parishioners but there are those that just go through the motions.  Yet continual invitation is part of the process.</p>
<p>I have had a family hold onto it for a whole year before they were ready.  They have been back to church for a couple of years now and they are engaged in parish life.</p>
<p>It seems as though when a life defining moment (along with God!) has sent a family into &#8220;seekers&#8221; mode, that they are usually open to building relationships within the community and with their faith. Yet families that have the usual societal pressures which begin with time, grandparents, etc. attempt the catch-up; they often don&#8217;t end up &#8220;seeking.&#8221;  They are just coming for &#8220;drive-thru&#8221; sacraments.</p>
<p>Over the last couple of years, I have tried a couple of different strategies.  What it seems to come down to though is that we need to spend time with these families.  It is a huge commitment on the part of a parish staff but well worth the efforts.</p>
<p>I have had parents do some additional home schooling to help bring children up-to-speed &#8212; this works sometimes and sometimes parents stop because of other life pressures.</p>
<p>I have added an assesment component. (each month, every 2 months) Done very conversationally, non-threatening, yet really dealing with content and after 1 meeting parents usually understand that there is some accountability.</p>
<p>I have had sessions devoted to older children focused on the sacraments which they attend in addition to their regular sessions.  Some years, they don&#8217;t attend their regular sessions for that time period.</p>
<p>This year, I have implemented a family RCIA.  Parents along with their children come on Sunday mornings and are learning together.  The parents were not thrilled to start but after a couple of months the parents are really grateful for their formation alongside their children.  I have 3 families.</p>
<p>There are some bumps and I realize that this won&#8217;t work for everyone because all of a sudden people will want a 1 year commitment&#8230;&#8230;but if they are truly formed and become a part of parish community,would they seek more for their families??  Could/would the RCIA process be an answer for families?  The parish would then have to have other offerings that would continue to draw them back.  The faith cannot be covered off in a year!  A relationship doesn&#8217;t have the definite ending.</p>
<p>Individual situations call for individual attention!  Wouldn&#8217;t it be great if we could do this for all the families in our midst?</p>
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		<title>By: elaine</title>
		<link>http://catechistsjourney.loyolapress.com/2008/10/31/catch-up-catechesis-kids-out-of-sequence/comment-page-1/#comment-876</link>
		<dc:creator>elaine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Nov 2008 03:36:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catechistsjourney.org/?p=526#comment-876</guid>
		<description>Thank you so much for writing this.  I am a first year Catechist and this has been an issue that really has been tugging at my heart.  The inconsistencies have really been tough for me ... (((SIGH))))</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you so much for writing this.  I am a first year Catechist and this has been an issue that really has been tugging at my heart.  The inconsistencies have really been tough for me &#8230; (((SIGH))))</p>
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